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  1. #1
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    Default I have a question to both naysayers and sayers

    I have a question, everyone who has read my posts on this covid-19 action knows my stance... a serious overreaction, and I still stand by that opinion. I have a question for both those that share the same opinion as I have and those that don't. I will start with a statement before I ask the question.

    The WHO (world health organization) estimates that 250,000 - 500,000 people die "EACH" year from the influenza virus we encounter year after year, and keep in mind this is something we have vaccines and treatments in place for, and it affects primarily the same age group as the covid-19 is especially fatal to, yet the world goes on, the economy for the most part goes unaffected by it.

    Somewhere between 20,000 - 60,000 people die in our own country from the influenza virus each year with same treatments, from same age group primarily and the world goes on as stated in first listed above.

    So far less than 9000 people have died world wide from covid-19 including places and countries that have seen the virus at such a unprecedented extreme scale and the world economy is on one of its worst downfalls

    So far a little more than 100 people have died in our country, most of which occurred under one roof in the state of Washington, and our economy once strong has TANKED and the worse is yet to come according to officials, I think we are headed to an economic downfall that we as individuals and as a country are not prepared for and am afraid how far it will go.

    We are whether you like it or not desocializing society which will have its own ramifications that we yet know as to what extent and to what extreme it will go.

    Looking at what I have stated above I want those that think this is an overreaction and those that think we are doing the right thing to think about the question I am about to ask and to rsespond without bashing or criticizing one anothers opinion. I also want to state that as an society death should never become accepted or ignored. Here is my question.


    Lets say that in the end 50,000 people die world wide or even 100,000 and lets say fatalities fall way short on our soil of what the influenza virus kills each and every year. How do react from here on out? as the flu virus comes back each year and on average kills 200,000 people world wide, what do we do? do we act as we are? if we don't are we putting a closed eye at the inevidable ? I still think this is an overreaction and am curious for those that think the same or don't think how we should approach flu season next year.
    Last edited by euphoric1; 03-18-2020 at 08:37 AM.

  2. #2
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    I believe it is a huge over reaction also. What worries me the most is the precedent that has now been set. Now, anytime there is a virus, this is what will happen. You will be told where you can and cannot go, whether you will be able to work or not work. The fear mongering by the media is out of control. I have two life long friends who are on the front lines, both nurses, they also say the media has blown this out of proportion. My work is not shut down, but if the government, state or federal, enacts a state wide quarantine, well, I will be beyond pissed.
    Lake Effect Snow, my three favorite words.

  3. #3
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    Dec 2009
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    NW IL
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    As Tae Adams from the Packers put it, "wash your hands, wash your butt". If people would stay home when the feel sick, practice better hygiene and not spread ANY virus or illness they may have, the epidemic would not be near as severe. Todays society goes to work sick all the time, some because they simply can't afford not to go to work. I do agree with you & think this is a little bit of overreaction by society. This strand of 'flu' virus, does appear to spread faster than others, but maybe it is just a case of more people travelling to a lot of other destinations that even 5-10 years ago was unheard of.

  4. #4
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    Neenah, Wisconsin is about 40 miles south of Green Bay's Lambeau Field.
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    Excellent post! I don't have an answer, too many unknowns. So much of the "panic" is cause and effect. They closed down the colleges and now the beaches in Florida are packed. Hospitals in Green Bay are at 97% capacity and paramedics are told to only transport the critical. Early on some stores ran low on Bath Tissue and then the hoarding began. I'm being perfectly honest here (and opinionated) I'm more concerned with the financial consequences then the health concerns. Each day this continues, the recovery is going to take longer and become more costly. We're probably in a Recession right now and don't even know it.
    Lastly, I feel great now but a month ago I was sick as a dog. The wife thinks I had the virus back in February, typical flu with chills, sweats, and a wicked cough that sounded like a dog barking. I felt miserable, was down for three weeks, but I fought through it like I always do and today I'm doing fine. "So, I got that going for me, which is nice."

    I was in a Lowes yesterday and talking with the checkout lady. Last weekend was crazy for crowds, everyone stocking up on "home projects" like paint and tile. Sounds like they're staying home and staying busy for the time being. That's what I'll be doing, catching up on my To Do List. Besides, the dog likes having me home all day, more treats and more exercise. Stay healthy, everyone!

  5. #5
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    I think everyone today over reacts to almost anything, it seems everyone needs some sort of shock value to get attention they MUST HAVE!
    FAME Is something far too many IMO place a priority on and they don't seem to care why or what gets them Fame!

    Next is, frivolous law suits, GOD there is no shortage of them, and I think many folks, and this includes the Government, is paranoid about NOT doing something more than, do logical things!
    the fear of being BASHED On TV< NEW and the world wide web alone seems to force so many into TRYING to do more, .say more, and fake feelings and emotions and blow up small things into huge things!
    again, part to show there TRYING< part to cover there butt's and part to again, get attention/fame!

    NOW< as of this current issue at hand, YES I think most are over reacting BIG time, but at the same time, I think the fear that is leading this wave, is the fact there is NO cure, or prevention of it from spreading !

    Yes the above flue's and illness's the OP used as examples, THEY DO have cures and treatments in place
    so even when they break out , there is a treatment to cure them!

    where as this thing, if it spreads and spreads with NO stopping it or cure, can possibly have some major effects , and that is where the FEAR and over reaction is coming from

    DO< you wait till things get REALLY bad before you REACT< or start NOW< before it gets worse?


    we as humans, grow real easy to over look things till they happen to US or one's we love!

    Starvation kills 25000+ people a yr in the USA< according to stat's I have seen, and few seem worried about that
    add in the tens of thousands that die in vehicle crashes every yr in the USA, and again, so few think twice about getting in a vehicle!
    and the main reason is, again, NO major Hype about it on the new's to get everyone excited about it!

    SO< over reacting, to this, YES many are, but, at what point SHOULD we really worry??

    the over reacting, if nothing else, should at least be forcing a cure to happen sooner, so, at least maybe that's a PLUS??

  6. #6
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    I really cannot see now one can make a full assessment. Like Gary said, too many unknowns. One of the reasons the extra precautions are being made is that the medical community does not and admits that they do not know a lot of about this virus.

    The mortality rate for the seasonal flu varies between around .01 to .02 percent in the US. So far this virus is at 1.5-2 percent. That is 100 times greater. So say that half the people in this country get it. Roughly 1 out of every 100 persons you know will die from it. Sound good?

    I guess I sit on the other side of most on this site, as I am one that has a compromised immune system due to childhood cancer as well as risk due to all of my heart issues. I am not panicked, or doing anything irrational. We did buy some extra groceries yesterday and I am going to pick up a few more things today and then we will be set for the next 2-3 weeks easy. Right now I feel safe going about in public and being diligent in my hygiene practices. I am going to start limiting my exposure to the general public after today and plan to self-quarantine myself to Jacobsville once spring breakers come back, as they are sure to bring it back to the Keweenaw. Had a regularly scheduled follow up with my Dr yesterday and said my plan sound very good. He said my risk of complications from it is higher and I really need to be careful.

    I must say that I am a little taken back by the selfishness of some, going about their day and not heeding anything that is asked of them. They probably feel THEY will get by just fine and most likely will. Unfortunately, their actions increases the risk that I and others will get it and could be in real trouble. All for what? A play date? Is everyone really so amped up that they cannot chill out for 2-3 weeks? And money...so you have a drop in income for a bit. Try owning your own business, happens all the time. If you run your business right, you will survive just fine. If you just collect a paycheck and cannot afford to be without income for a few weeks. God help you. You are living way beyond you means and it was going to catch up with you sooner or later.

    I think back to "The Greatest Generation". The sacrifices these folks made is unbelievable. Many went without a meal that contained their typical elements for years. Folks grew "Victory Gardens" so that the troops could get the food they would have otherwise eaten. It was not about themselves, it was about survival for all. In my opinion, we are at the opposite end of the spectrum these days. Me, Me, Me. That is what will take this country down. Not a virus or a recession.

    -John

  7. #7
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    I'm in the over reaction camp, but I can understand some of it.

    What I can't understand is the panic being put in place and how people are clearing store shelves. I go to the grocery store everyday and talk with the people there and they have seen the decline in humanity first hand. What the **** are you going to do with 24 rolls of TP, much less 6 bags of 24 rolls at a time!!!

    I said to a guy checking out with among a cart full of things, two 5lb bags of sugar the other day: "That must be quite the birthday cake you are making!" He snickered at me and walked out. Really???

    They are telling us not to hang out or go to crowded spaces, yet people are crowding into stores and pushing each other through the isles to get a couple bags of sugar??

    This kinda says it all:
    IMG_3782.JPG

  8. #8
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    Dec 2009
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    Burlington, WI
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Administrator View Post
    I really cannot see now one can make a full assessment. Like Gary said, too many unknowns. One of the reasons the extra precautions are being made is that the medical community does not and admits that they do not know a lot of about this virus.

    The mortality rate for the seasonal flu varies between around .01 to .02 percent in the US. So far this virus is at 1.5-2 percent. That is 100 times greater. So say that half the people in this country get it. Roughly 1 out of every 100 persons you know will die from it. Sound good?

    I guess I sit on the other side of most on this site, as I am one that has a compromised immune system due to childhood cancer as well as risk due to all of my heart issues. I am not panicked, or doing anything irrational. We did buy some extra groceries yesterday and I am going to pick up a few more things today and then we will be set for the next 2-3 weeks easy. Right now I feel safe going about in public and being diligent in my hygiene practices. I am going to start limiting my exposure to the general public after today and plan to self-quarantine myself to Jacobsville once spring breakers come back, as they are sure to bring it back to the Keweenaw. Had a regularly scheduled follow up with my Dr yesterday and said my plan sound very good. He said my risk of complications from it is higher and I really need to be careful.

    I must say that I am a little taken back by the selfishness of some, going about their day and not heeding anything that is asked of them. They probably feel THEY will get by just fine and most likely will. Unfortunately, their actions increases the risk that I and others will get it and could be in real trouble. All for what? A play date? Is everyone really so amped up that they cannot chill out for 2-3 weeks? And money...so you have a drop in income for a bit. Try owning your own business, happens all the time. If you run your business right, you will survive just fine. If you just collect a paycheck and cannot afford to be without income for a few weeks. God help you. You are living way beyond you means and it was going to catch up with you sooner or later.

    I think back to "The Greatest Generation". The sacrifices these folks made is unbelievable. Many went without a meal that contained their typical elements for years. Folks grew "Victory Gardens" so that the troops could get the food they would have otherwise eaten. It was not about themselves, it was about survival for all. In my opinion, we are at the opposite end of the spectrum these days. Me, Me, Me. That is what will take this country down. Not a virus or a recession.

    -John
    I agree with this statement wholeheartedly! Have any of the naysayers taken a look at what happened and is happening in Italy? This is what the US is trying to prevent.

  9. #9
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    Well said, John.

  10. #10
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    I agree John. Wisconsin shut bars and restaurants down yesterday at 5. I could not believe the people crying on facebook about missing a drinking holiday. People are selfish.

  11. #11
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    Dec 2009
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    Hortonville, Wi
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    Agreed major overreaction. I believe there’s more going on though than what they want us to believe. Translate Covid to Hebrew and translate that Hebrew translation back to English guess what it is? Kobe. What cemetery was Kobe buried in? Corona Del Mar. hmmmmmm... dozens of CEO’s have stepped down in the last couple months. Where did Bill Gates go?
    Last edited by indy_500; 03-18-2020 at 10:32 AM.

  12. #12

    Default

    hundreds of millions of actuaries are working on this now!

  13. #13
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    Dec 2009
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    Manitowish Waters, WI and Village of Summit, Wisconsin
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    I think this is a huge over reaction based on the numbers that just don't add up. As stated, will this become the new norm every year for the flu virus and plunge us into hysteria and panic constantly?

    Is this what socialism is? I think its fairly close. In short, small and large business cannot survive being told to shut down. I truly believe that in a week or so, the bars and restaurant owners will face the fact that unless they take things into their own hands and re-open to start making a living that they have worked so hard to create it will all be lost. There comes a time when people will stand up and say enough is enough and I am one of them.

    In speaking with my daughter who is 29, I get the impression that their generation is the most worried about this as it is their first major crisis and they don't know how to handle it. She is worried that their business may close and that they might lose their house. I tried to tell her that this is highly unlikely but I could tell in her voice that she was not convinced. For me, I am almost at retirement age and have made my living and have been very fortunate but what about all these young people who up until 3 weeks ago were really enjoying the fruits of a string economy and getting ahead in life?

    Its a sad situation and I think that by April first if it has not subsided people will make it subside and we will get on with our lives like we always do.

    Don't even get me started about the media, someone should pull the plug and we should go dark, we would all be better off not listening to them, I have started this already and refuse to watch the news. It reminds me of 9/11 when all it was 24/7 blasted in your face until you just got sick of it and had to turn the TV off.

    God Bless America and all of our great people here that have common sense, By the way, Common Sense is free!

  14. #14
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    Mar 2013
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    Ptown, Ill
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    3,438

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Administrator View Post
    I really cannot see now one can make a full assessment. Like Gary said, too many unknowns. One of the reasons the extra precautions are being made is that the medical community does not and admits that they do not know a lot of about this virus.

    The mortality rate for the seasonal flu varies between around .01 to .02 percent in the US. So far this virus is at 1.5-2 percent. That is 100 times greater. So say that half the people in this country get it. Roughly 1 out of every 100 persons you know will die from it. Sound good?

    I guess I sit on the other side of most on this site, as I am one that has a compromised immune system due to childhood cancer as well as risk due to all of my heart issues. I am not panicked, or doing anything irrational. We did buy some extra groceries yesterday and I am going to pick up a few more things today and then we will be set for the next 2-3 weeks easy. Right now I feel safe going about in public and being diligent in my hygiene practices. I am going to start limiting my exposure to the general public after today and plan to self-quarantine myself to Jacobsville once spring breakers come back, as they are sure to bring it back to the Keweenaw. Had a regularly scheduled follow up with my Dr yesterday and said my plan sound very good. He said my risk of complications from it is higher and I really need to be careful.

    I must say that I am a little taken back by the selfishness of some, going about their day and not heeding anything that is asked of them. They probably feel THEY will get by just fine and most likely will. Unfortunately, their actions increases the risk that I and others will get it and could be in real trouble. All for what? A play date? Is everyone really so amped up that they cannot chill out for 2-3 weeks? And money...so you have a drop in income for a bit. Try owning your own business, happens all the time. If you run your business right, you will survive just fine. If you just collect a paycheck and cannot afford to be without income for a few weeks. God help you. You are living way beyond you means and it was going to catch up with you sooner or later.

    I think back to "The Greatest Generation". The sacrifices these folks made is unbelievable. Many went without a meal that contained their typical elements for years. Folks grew "Victory Gardens" so that the troops could get the food they would have otherwise eaten. It was not about themselves, it was about survival for all. In my opinion, we are at the opposite end of the spectrum these days. Me, Me, Me. That is what will take this country down. Not a virus or a recession.

    -John
    Well stated John, I agree!

  15. #15
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    Dec 2009
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    Glen Ellyn, IL./Pence, Wi.
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    A couple things to keep in mind with the mortality percentage, where it started the living conditions are more like camps, high percentage of contraction plus were they tested or just assumed to have had it? I'm not sure about all states but in Illinois the test is controlled by the state. They have final and only approval for a patient to receive a test. I know a prominent Chicago area hospital was refused approval for a test as recent as yesterday. They basically can tell its likely Wuhan 2019 (the real name) if the patient shows symptoms and tests negative for regular influenza. Once the test has wide spread availability, the positives will climb rapidly and the mortality rate will decline.

    This has been around around a few months. It's not like the movies where "Patient X" got on a plane after playing with monkeys (nothing against monkeys) in Asia and went straight to a Knicks game in NYC, infecting everyone along the way. It was discovered (or created) in late 2019 (the "19" in the name) and thousands traveled freely in the fall, thru the holidays right up to last couple weeks. A few weeks ago, it was all about the cruise ships, docked, floating at sea, quarantined, denied port. As far as I know, there are no ghost cruise ships floating around with no survivors? A cruise ship is about the worst place to be for a "pandemic" or any outbreak. Well known for rotovirus, norovirus and other outbreaks, Limited medical aid, limited food, community just about everything except sleeping. I think the cruise ships actually answer a few of the variables. The contagion can be dormant in a affected person for up to 14 days, I think many of the ships have surpassed that time frame since the first case and who knows how many passengers were infected prior to 1st cases being reported. If you research and follow up with these ships, it has not been full blown infection. They did quarantine, but that doesn't mean several were not infected prior to that. I personally thing the MSM blew it out of proportion and China saw an opportunity to jump in and push it to the limit we see today. It's so deep there is no turning back. I am in the overreaction group, but the fear has been planted and the only resolutions are the current actions.


    Quote Originally Posted by Administrator View Post
    I really cannot see now one can make a full assessment. Like Gary said, too many unknowns. One of the reasons the extra precautions are being made is that the medical community does not and admits that they do not know a lot of about this virus.

    The mortality rate for the seasonal flu varies between around .01 to .02 percent in the US. So far this virus is at 1.5-2 percent. That is 100 times greater. So say that half the people in this country get it. Roughly 1 out of every 100 persons you know will die from it. Sound good?

    I guess I sit on the other side of most on this site, as I am one that has a compromised immune system due to childhood cancer as well as risk due to all of my heart issues. I am not panicked, or doing anything irrational. We did buy some extra groceries yesterday and I am going to pick up a few more things today and then we will be set for the next 2-3 weeks easy. Right now I feel safe going about in public and being diligent in my hygiene practices. I am going to start limiting my exposure to the general public after today and plan to self-quarantine myself to Jacobsville once spring breakers come back, as they are sure to bring it back to the Keweenaw. Had a regularly scheduled follow up with my Dr yesterday and said my plan sound very good. He said my risk of complications from it is higher and I really need to be careful.

    I must say that I am a little taken back by the selfishness of some, going about their day and not heeding anything that is asked of them. They probably feel THEY will get by just fine and most likely will. Unfortunately, their actions increases the risk that I and others will get it and could be in real trouble. All for what? A play date? Is everyone really so amped up that they cannot chill out for 2-3 weeks? And money...so you have a drop in income for a bit. Try owning your own business, happens all the time. If you run your business right, you will survive just fine. If you just collect a paycheck and cannot afford to be without income for a few weeks. God help you. You are living way beyond you means and it was going to catch up with you sooner or later.

    I think back to "The Greatest Generation". The sacrifices these folks made is unbelievable. Many went without a meal that contained their typical elements for years. Folks grew "Victory Gardens" so that the troops could get the food they would have otherwise eaten. It was not about themselves, it was about survival for all. In my opinion, we are at the opposite end of the spectrum these days. Me, Me, Me. That is what will take this country down. Not a virus or a recession.

    -John

  16. #16
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
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    Midwest
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    Quote Originally Posted by Administrator View Post
    I really cannot see now one can make a full assessment. Like Gary said, too many unknowns. One of the reasons the extra precautions are being made is that the medical community does not and admits that they do not know a lot of about this virus.

    The mortality rate for the seasonal flu varies between around .01 to .02 percent in the US. So far this virus is at 1.5-2 percent. That is 100 times greater. So say that half the people in this country get it. Roughly 1 out of every 100 persons you know will die from it. Sound good?

    I guess I sit on the other side of most on this site, as I am one that has a compromised immune system due to childhood cancer as well as risk due to all of my heart issues. I am not panicked, or doing anything irrational. We did buy some extra groceries yesterday and I am going to pick up a few more things today and then we will be set for the next 2-3 weeks easy. Right now I feel safe going about in public and being diligent in my hygiene practices. I am going to start limiting my exposure to the general public after today and plan to self-quarantine myself to Jacobsville once spring breakers come back, as they are sure to bring it back to the Keweenaw. Had a regularly scheduled follow up with my Dr yesterday and said my plan sound very good. He said my risk of complications from it is higher and I really need to be careful.

    I must say that I am a little taken back by the selfishness of some, going about their day and not heeding anything that is asked of them. They probably feel THEY will get by just fine and most likely will. Unfortunately, their actions increases the risk that I and others will get it and could be in real trouble. All for what? A play date? Is everyone really so amped up that they cannot chill out for 2-3 weeks? And money...so you have a drop in income for a bit. Try owning your own business, happens all the time. If you run your business right, you will survive just fine. If you just collect a paycheck and cannot afford to be without income for a few weeks. God help you. You are living way beyond you means and it was going to catch up with you sooner or later.

    I think back to "The Greatest Generation". The sacrifices these folks made is unbelievable. Many went without a meal that contained their typical elements for years. Folks grew "Victory Gardens" so that the troops could get the food they would have otherwise eaten. It was not about themselves, it was about survival for all. In my opinion, we are at the opposite end of the spectrum these days. Me, Me, Me. That is what will take this country down. Not a virus or a recession.

    -John
    The mortality rate for the seasonal flu is around .1% not .01% as John mentioned. However, this still makes the coronavirus 10 times more deadly than the regular flu which is nothing to sneeze at. I can't believe all the macho folks here that think this is nothing worse than a cold.
    Last edited by Midwest Player; 03-19-2020 at 02:45 AM.

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Midwest Player View Post
    The mortality rate for the seasonal flu is around .1% not .01% as John mentioned. However, this still makes the coronavirus 10 times more deadly than the regular flu which is nothing to sneeze at. I can't believe all the macho folks here that think this is nothing worse than a cold.
    It's because it affects them and nothing makes a boomer mad than something affecting them personally. I've been thinking for a long time how millennials get blamed for the me me me but it's times like this the over 50 crowd are the ones complaining about how it affects them personally. I'm still working and will be until we get shut down. That doesn't mean I'm licking door knobs.

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Midwest Player View Post
    The mortality rate for the seasonal flu is around .1% not .01% as John mentioned. However, this still makes the coronavirus 10 times more deadly than the regular flu which is nothing to sneeze at. I can't believe all the macho folks here that think this is nothing worse than a cold.
    For most people who get the SARS-CoV-2 virus, it is nothing more than a cold. And since they are likely thousands of people who had the virus and were never treated for it, the mortality rate is probably below 1%, and might not be any worse than the common flu.

    This panic and lockdown might be causing more long-term harm than if we did nothing at all (other than tell high-risk individuals to stay home). By not allowing healthy people to be exposed to it, we are not building herd immunity, which will set the stage for a second wave in the fall.

  19. #19
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    I have to laugh...News media now posting confirmed cases like some kind of score board, what a joke. I have news for all of you selfish doomsday preppers out there that are clearing the shelves of food and supplies that common sense people need to feed their families on a daily basis... HOW DO YOU KNOW YOU DONT HAVE IT???? or your kids, husband or neighbors, have you watched the news are you that oblivious??? we are not testing other that at risk people and you have to be prescreened to be tested, you may have it and not even know it for 2 weeks or may not even know you have it at all, the score board is just a Bullsh** number of mostly at risk people who have it, not real numbers people!! One major manufacturing plant shut down because 1 person tested positive, would someone please explain to me how this makes sense when for all we know 50% of the general public may have it but we will never know that for sure because 80% or more of the general public don't fall under that "at risk" population. Meanwhile we are closing or limiting capacities (which might as well say close) at bars, resturants putting people out of work, and now expanding to manufacturing and who knows what. Then you have the wisdom filled local governments asking people to continue to support these businesses that they closed by getting carry out, Ive got news for you...if people aren't working they aren't spending money, we will likely loose a lot of small business as a result of serious overreaction. I figured I would go to grocery store at open this morning only to find out just as busy as a Saturday when other times there may be half a dozen cars in lot, I went inside and I now know when the hoarders are shopping, one person probably had a dozen loaves of bread of all kinds in their cart and as I walked by I had to ask..."are you going to eat all that?" just got a look, COME ON PEOPLE!. State announced also that they are going to rewrite unemployment guidelines not requiring people to have to look for other work, the only people this is a clear benefit is to those that have been living off unemployment for way too long already, because lets face it up until now if you don't have a job you just don't want to work for the most part, How about extending the time to have to repay taxes on the unemployment benefits, and not penalizing the employer by raising their unemployment insurance rates since im sure 90% or more of the businesses that are closed would have rather stayed open. If we are only testing at risk people, we are essentially telling the largest group of the population to ride it out, why the heck are we penalizing society, businesses, world economy and finances because of the "at risk population" ? Its not that I don't care about the at risk people but hundreds of thousands of people die each year from the flu virus. doesn't anyone realize what this overreaction is doing to what keeps this world moving??? PATHETIC I'M SORRY then you had the person on the news who complained how uncomfortable the test was pushing a swab up her news that made her eyes water and forced her to sneeze!! how stupid! Before some accuses me of not caring about the at risk people... I am one of those since I was 27 I have had 2 heart surgeries, I have had 2 strokes in the last 5 years and I take a slew of medications each and every day yet I am not walking around in this "BUBBLE" or living in it, what happens...happens, you aren't going to stop it.
    Last edited by euphoric1; 03-19-2020 at 08:57 AM.

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Midwest Player View Post
    The mortality rate for the seasonal flu is around .1% not .01% as John mentioned. However, this still makes the coronavirus 10 times more deadly than the regular flu which is nothing to sneeze at. I can't believe all the macho folks here that think this is nothing worse than a cold.

    The problem I have with the mortality comparison, which is a major factor is the testing. The current Covid-19 rate should be followed by "OF THE PATIENTS WHO HAVE BEN TESTED". the flu test is readily available and widely administered. the Covid-19 test so far has been primarily only approved for "at risk" patients. If mostly at risk patients are only being the mortality rate is obviously going to be higher. When the testing becomes widespread and healthy people are testing positive, the rate will go down. Not saying it's nothing to worry about, just that even the percentages can be inaccurate without all details. Just reported yesterday, 99% of all Italy deaths have been in "at risk" population.

    Has anyone on the site been tested for Covid-19?

  21. #21
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    Italy had 475 deaths Yesterday (Wednesday) up from 345 the day before. Up 40% in one day. Yes, Italy is more densely populated, but still this is serious. The US I believe is a couple weeks behind Italy. This is what is trying to be prevented. Learning from what has already happened elsewhere. Look at the statistics on the link below.

    https://www.worldometers.info/corona...country/italy/

  22. #22
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    totally agree, you present facts regarding the #s and the danger- and John you are so kind to the yappers that don't really know anything medically (myself included) or even have the #s but still have these strong opinions somehow-In 1918 with a population of only 102,000,000 people, we lost 675,000 people to the Flu in the US, which could have been a much smaller # if people would have listened to the health experts at the time,which was "wash your hands-keep your distance even if you feel fine" I am even keeping distance from my own family -which they fully support!!! I think it's because of the virus but I am not sure!!! take care everyone - I wish you all the best

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by gary_in_neenah View Post
    Excellent post! I don't have an answer, too many unknowns. So much of the "panic" is cause and effect. They closed down the colleges and now the beaches in Florida are packed. Hospitals in Green Bay are at 97% capacity and paramedics are told to only transport the critical. Early on some stores ran low on Bath Tissue and then the hoarding began. I'm being perfectly honest here (and opinionated) I'm more concerned with the financial consequences then the health concerns. Each day this continues, the recovery is going to take longer and become more costly. We're probably in a Recession right now and don't even know it.
    Lastly, I feel great now but a month ago I was sick as a dog. The wife thinks I had the virus back in February, typical flu with chills, sweats, and a wicked cough that sounded like a dog barking. I felt miserable, was down for three weeks, but I fought through it like I always do and today I'm doing fine. "So, I got that going for me, which is nice."

    I was in a Lowes yesterday and talking with the checkout lady. Last weekend was crazy for crowds, everyone stocking up on "home projects" like paint and tile. Sounds like they're staying home and staying busy for the time being. That's what I'll be doing, catching up on my To Do List. Besides, the dog likes having me home all day, more treats and more exercise. Stay healthy, everyone!
    In bold....why?...was there another big wreck on the freeway?....it sure isn't the 50 ppl who have a cold.

    - - - Updated - - -

    This is just another cold.
    We all have been through the cold and flu season before.

    This is a time where all should be gathering in protest.
    If we don't, we still send an equally powerful message.

  24. #24
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    The economy has been destroyed. Over nothing.

  25. #25
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    Amazing the liberal left has most of the cards. They control most media outlets. But they continue to misplay those cards. Funny actually.

  26. #26
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    So I have a question......How many people do you need to see get sick or die before you want to see some kind of action taken?? Are you going to complain If you become sick and need medical care but hospitals are full or medical staff is too short and no one to care for you?
    Is this overreaction... probably.....but isn't better safe than sorry?

  27. #27

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    There's actually a World wide shortage of some surgical textiles at the moment, starting even before COVID-19. Hospitals are scrambling, and in some cases, they can't get the PPE their employees need. This will continue through the end of the year before supplies recover.

    I would personally like to avoid going to the hospital for COVID-19, if healthcare professionals aren't there to treat me because there is no PPE for them to protect themselves.

    This is absolutely a real concern, and it will be interesting to see how bad this gets before PPE supply stock recovers.

  28. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by eagle1 View Post
    So I have a question......How many people do you need to see get sick or die before you want to see some kind of action taken??
    Ask that same question about the regular flu

  29. #29
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    i believe huge over reaction
    that being said Im all for being cautious, I understand closing the schools being closed.
    I think this is going to be used to increase government control that they wont give up easily and how are we going to pay for all the votes they are already beginning to promise to buy?
    Italy has an old population cramed into the area the size of arizona
    We have 5 times the population and 32 times the land, (sure Alaska would reduce that) but still they keep comparing this us to italy in numbers....

  30. #30
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    Taken off of Facebook from someone who lives in Spain...

    Day 3 of quarantine (it honestly seems like day 89).....


    Thank you all for reaching out and checking on us with your phone calls and text messages. As most of you know, the entire country of Spain is in lockdown status. I was absolutely shocked at how quickly our busy little beach town turned into a ghost town in just a matter of hours. The original quarantine time frame was 15 days, but since Spain's Covid-19 cases are rapidly on the rise, the lockdown may be actually anywhere from 4 weeks to 4 months. As of today, there were 11,178 reported cases, which is 2,000 more than yesterday.


    Many of you have asked what exactly does this mean for our family. Dean can only go to work if it is mission essential to the US Navy. Otherwise, he teleworks from home. He carries a letter from the Navy that may or may not get him out of a ticket when traveling for work. I can only leave for groceries or for the pharmacy. We must always travel alone and we must have a receipt in case we get pulled over by the National Police. (If anyone ignores the quarantine rules, then they are faced with hefty fines and/or jail time).


    It's scarier that I would like to admit and all so surreal. We are doing alright and taking advantage of lots of family time, but honestly we miss our freedom. Our girls begin online school tomorrow and we are grateful to our teachers for putting in so much extra work. We are also fortunate to have a yard, so that we can get at least go outside each day. Most Spaniards do not have this luxury and live in apartments with their entire extended family.


    To all our friends in the states and throughout the entire world...THIS IS COMING. In just the US alone, cases rose 1,100 in the last 7 hours. Heed our warnings and learn from our mistakes. There is no more time. Last week we were in the "just wash your hands and social distance stage" and now we are in full lockdown mode" for an undetermined period of time. I never in a million years would have thought I would be quarantined in my own home. By the time we took it seriously, it was too late.
    Please listen to the health officials, cancel social gatherings and limit contact with others to slow the infection rate. Stay inside, keep your children home, and understand this virus has a 2 week incubation period. You could be spreading the germs to every single person that you come in contact with for 2 full weeks and not even know it. Your actions now will make a huge difference for the next few weeks/months to come. This is no longer about you. Be the good.


    Please thank every nurse, doctor, and teacher the next time you see them. They give more than we will ever know. <3


    Stay safe and stay healthy. Thank you again for checking in on us. Love and miss you all. xoxoxoxo

  31. #31
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    Totally agree with Euphoric and Skylar. What is unprecedented is the over reaction. Not disagreeing with what John said either. Common sense and courtesy needs to be part of our society, but to get to the point where businesses are being mandated to close is over board. My opinion the over reaction is going to cause more hardship that the virus to the majority of the country. I know...tell that to the people who died. I get it.
    Last edited by dfattack; 03-18-2020 at 09:13 PM.

  32. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by euphoric1 View Post
    I have a question, everyone who has read my posts on this covid-19 action knows my stance... a serious overreaction, and I still stand by that opinion. I have a question for both those that share the same opinion as I have and those that don't. I will start with a statement before I ask the question.

    The WHO (world health organization) estimates that 250,000 - 500,000 people die "EACH" year from the influenza virus we encounter year after year, and keep in mind this is something we have vaccines and treatments in place for, and it affects primarily the same age group as the covid-19 is especially fatal to, yet the world goes on, the economy for the most part goes unaffected by it.

    Somewhere between 20,000 - 60,000 people die in our own country from the influenza virus each year with same treatments, from same age group primarily and the world goes on as stated in first listed above.

    So far less than 9000 people have died world wide from covid-19 including places and countries that have seen the virus at such a unprecedented extreme scale and the world economy is on one of its worst downfalls

    So far a little more than 100 people have died in our country, most of which occurred under one roof in the state of Washington, and our economy once strong has TANKED and the worse is yet to come according to officials, I think we are headed to an economic downfall that we as individuals and as a country are not prepared for and am afraid how far it will go.

    We are whether you like it or not desocializing society which will have its own ramifications that we yet know as to what extent and to what extreme it will go.

    Looking at what I have stated above I want those that think this is an overreaction and those that think we are doing the right thing to think about the question I am about to ask and to rsespond without bashing or criticizing one anothers opinion. I also want to state that as an society death should never become accepted or ignored. Here is my question.


    Lets say that in the end 50,000 people die world wide or even 100,000 and lets say fatalities fall way short on our soil of what the influenza virus kills each and every year. How do react from here on out? as the flu virus comes back each year and on average kills 200,000 people world wide, what do we do? do we act as we are? if we don't are we putting a closed eye at the inevidable ? I still think this is an overreaction and am curious for those that think the same or don't think how we should approach flu season next year.
    Did you say Naysayers?
    From Seinfeld;

    "Well, you made a long journey from Milan to Minsk, Rochelle, Rochelle. You never stopped hoping; now you're in a Pinsk, Rochelle, Rochelle. When the naysayers 'nay' you picked up your pace. You said nothing's going to stop me so get out of my face. I'm having adventures all over the place, Rochelle, ROCHELLE!"

    Bear

  33. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by euphoric1 View Post
    I have a question, everyone who has read my posts on this covid-19 action knows my stance... a serious overreaction, and I still stand by that opinion. I have a question for both those that share the same opinion as I have and those that don't. I will start with a statement before I ask the question.

    The WHO (world health organization) estimates that 250,000 - 500,000 people die "EACH" year from the influenza virus we encounter year after year, and keep in mind this is something we have vaccines and treatments in place for, and it affects primarily the same age group as the covid-19 is especially fatal to, yet the world goes on, the economy for the most part goes unaffected by it.

    Somewhere between 20,000 - 60,000 people die in our own country from the influenza virus each year with same treatments, from same age group primarily and the world goes on as stated in first listed above.

    So far less than 9000 people have died world wide from covid-19 including places and countries that have seen the virus at such a unprecedented extreme scale and the world economy is on one of its worst downfalls

    So far a little more than 100 people have died in our country, most of which occurred under one roof in the state of Washington, and our economy once strong has TANKED and the worse is yet to come according to officials, I think we are headed to an economic downfall that we as individuals and as a country are not prepared for and am afraid how far it will go.

    We are whether you like it or not desocializing society which will have its own ramifications that we yet know as to what extent and to what extreme it will go.

    Looking at what I have stated above I want those that think this is an overreaction and those that think we are doing the right thing to think about the question I am about to ask and to rsespond without bashing or criticizing one anothers opinion. I also want to state that as an society death should never become accepted or ignored. Here is my question.


    Lets say that in the end 50,000 people die world wide or even 100,000 and lets say fatalities fall way short on our soil of what the influenza virus kills each and every year. How do react from here on out? as the flu virus comes back each year and on average kills 200,000 people world wide, what do we do? do we act as we are? if we don't are we putting a closed eye at the inevidable ? I still think this is an overreaction and am curious for those that think the same or don't think how we should approach flu season next year.
    Well said...I agree

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