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  1. #1
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    Default Real virus statistics

    https://coronavirusbellcurve.com

    Normalized data ... the curve is flattening....not what your hearing on media...this is the actual data...not quite as bad as being portrayed

  2. #2
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    Be advised, my malware protection went red alert nuclear when I clicked on the site posted above.
    Danger danger Will Robinson....

  3. #3
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    Better Site here John Hopkins

    https://coronavirus.jhu.edu/map.html

  4. #4
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    Nobody will be working in an office environment until mid-June at the earliest. I don’t mean to scare anyone, but eventually, 1 out of every 2000 people in the USA will die from this. I didn't think this was serious at first either. Now I do.

    Check out this link:
    https://covid19.healthdata.org/projections

    This is from Chris Murray at the University of Washington. The data for this model is updated every morning at 6:00 am. PST. On the home page of IHME there is a update tab explaining changes. This dude is the best metrics guy in the country. The White House and Dr Birx are using his projections.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tracker View Post
    https://coronavirusbellcurve.com

    Normalized data ... the curve is flattening....not what your hearing on media...this is the actual data...not quite as bad as being portrayed
    Perhaps you try to get real?

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigSix View Post
    Nobody will be working in an office environment until mid-June at the earliest. I don’t mean to scare anyone, but eventually, 1 out of every 2000 people in the USA will die from this. I didn't think this was serious at first either. Now I do.

    Check out this link:
    https://covid19.healthdata.org/projections

    This is from Chris Murray at the University of Washington. The data for this model is updated every morning at 6:00 am. PST. On the home page of IHME there is a update tab explaining changes. This dude is the best metrics guy in the country. The White House and Dr Birx are using his projections.
    Nobody? LOL, almost everyone at my workplace is still working in the office. Only a few are working from home.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by DamageInc View Post
    Nobody? LOL, almost everyone at my workplace is still working in the office. Only a few are working from home.
    Good luck w/ that

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lost Sheep View Post
    Good luck w/ that
    I think you missed the point. While some people are spreading hysteria, fear, and false information, life goes on for most of us. The only thing different is that we can't go out to eat, and there is no toilet paper at the store.

  9. #9
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    The virus is real, any statistic is a guess and an overstatement as there are no real true numbers except those that have died, 200,000 americans going to die in next 2 weeks??? I hope I am wrong but I find that very hard to believe, just more media hype, government may mandate masks... GREAT... More things that the selfish, piggish only care about themselves select society to just discard all over the place for someone else to have to clean up.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by euphoric1 View Post
    The virus is real, any statistic is a guess and an overstatement as there are no real true numbers except those that have died, 200,000 americans going to die in next 2 weeks??? I hope I am wrong but I find that very hard to believe, just more media hype, government may mandate masks... GREAT... More things that the selfish, piggish only care about themselves select society to just discard all over the place for someone else to have to clean up.
    There are gloves all over the parking lot of my local grocery store. Some people are just unbelievable.

  11. #11
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    Nobody knows how many people have had this virus and recovered without ever having a test to see if they had it. Also most of the fatalities had underlying issues before the virus kicked in. How many of them would have died anyway? Nobody knows. So there is no way to calculate a definite mortality rate. You need 3 numbers to figure that out and the only number you have is how many people have been tested. Yes this is bad. But for the most part it is killing the old, the sick and the weak. Who were all going to die first anyway.

  12. #12
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    I love computer models, always so accurate!
    Lake Effect Snow, my three favorite words.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by grub View Post
    Nobody knows how many people have had this virus and recovered without ever having a test to see if they had it. Also most of the fatalities had underlying issues before the virus kicked in. How many of them would have died anyway? Nobody knows. So there is no way to calculate a definite mortality rate. You need 3 numbers to figure that out and the only number you have is how many people have been tested. Yes this is bad. But for the most part it is killing the old, the sick and the weak. Who were all going to die first anyway.
    THAT"S RIGHT! we should all just wheel them all off a cliff! That will show them for getting old, weak or sick!


    Er....wait a minute, I would be one of them.

    Thanks for the compassion Grub.

    PS I tried looking for an emoji for heartless, but could not find one. Please forgive me.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by euphoric1 View Post
    The virus is real, any statistic is a guess and an overstatement as there are no real true numbers except those that have died, 200,000 americans going to die in next 2 weeks??? I hope I am wrong but I find that very hard to believe, just more media hype, government may mandate masks... GREAT... More things that the selfish, piggish only care about themselves select society to just discard all over the place for someone else to have to clean up.
    I've not seen any predictions of 200,000 Americans going to die in the next 2 weeks. They are however saying that those numbers are possible over the entire course of the outbreak. As far as selfish and piggish go, the people that are not following the guidelines for social distancing, eliminating non-essential traveling, etc.. fall into that category. They are putting others that they come in contact with at risk as well as themselves.

  15. #15
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    My main concern with all this is the precedent we are setting. What happens the next time this or any other virus sweeps the globe?

    Not many are going to want to be in a service industry job, where you might be TOLD you can't work, no matter how much you want to. Just saying. Restaurants and the like are going to take a beating on this for MONTHS, LONG after "they" tell us its ok to go out again.

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by boilerrph View Post
    I've not seen any predictions of 200,000 Americans going to die in the next 2 weeks. They are however saying that those numbers are possible over the entire course of the outbreak. As far as selfish and piggish go, the people that are not following the guidelines for social distancing, eliminating non-essential traveling, etc.. fall into that category. They are putting others that they come in contact with at risk as well as themselves.
    This virus is not going away. All we are doing is delaying our inevitable exposure to it. We should be sheltering those who are at high risk (elderly, compromised immune systems, etc.) and the rest of us should just live our lives.

    If you are pinning your hopes on a vaccine, you should know that coronavirus immunity doesn't typically last very long. Also, the first SARS virus (2003) was very similar to this one, and they never succeeded in developing an effective vaccine. They have learned a lot about vaccines since then, but it doesn't change the fact that a vaccine for SARS-CoV-2 could take years to develop, it might only give immunity for a short period of time, and it might not happen at all.

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by grub View Post
    Nobody knows how many people have had this virus and recovered without ever having a test to see if they had it. Also most of the fatalities had underlying issues before the virus kicked in. How many of them would have died anyway? Nobody knows. So there is no way to calculate a definite mortality rate. You need 3 numbers to figure that out and the only number you have is how many people have been tested. Yes this is bad. But for the most part it is killing the old, the sick and the weak. Who were all going to die first anyway.
    Quote Originally Posted by Administrator View Post
    THAT"S RIGHT! we should all just wheel them all off a cliff! That will show them for getting old, weak or sick!


    Er....wait a minute, I would be one of them.

    Thanks for the compassion Grub.

    PS I tried looking for an emoji for heartless, but could not find one. Please forgive me.
    It always amazes me to read some of the statements that are made by some on this site. It seems that many do not put a very high value on human life. Some seem to think that it's acceptable for the numerous fatalities on the snowmobile trails and now some are comparing the loss of life due to the covid-19 virus to the seasonal influenza and rationalizing that this is not more severe than the seasonal influenza. I am here to tell you that this is much more serious. I am a clinical pharmacist at a large hospital and we are just beginning to see the influx of covid patients. Although the groups that Grub mentioned are the most at risk, I can tell you that there are a significant number of hospitalized patients that do not fall in the high risk group. Just out of curiosity Grub, how do you know that the old, sick and weak "WERE ALL GOING TO DIE FIRST ANYWAY"?

    John, I pray that you and your family stay safe and healthy through this challenging time and as a fellow Purdue guy I say BOILER UP!!!

  18. #18
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    Take a look at all the businesses that are in the Northwoods Directory on this site! These businesses can’t survive being closed down much longer, and the lasting effects of this will be devastating for the ones who do make it thru. There’s a huge chance your favorite bar,lodge,motel or resort will be closed next winter. If you think closing down the whole country, state is good idea,then I suggest looking at this through my eyes as business owner. Is the cure worse than the virus? It all depends who you ask! A person that was sent home with full pay that works for the government would say no! A husband and wife that may lose everything in short few months would say yes.

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by boilerrph View Post
    I've not seen any predictions of 200,000 Americans going to die in the next 2 weeks. They are however saying that those numbers are possible over the entire course of the outbreak. As far as selfish and piggish go, the people that are not following the guidelines for social distancing, eliminating non-essential traveling, etc.. fall into that category. They are putting others that they come in contact with at risk as well as themselves.
    I find it very ironic that the very people choosing to wear the protection to protect themselves obviously don't give a crap for their fellow americans knowing someone will have to clean up after them putting the rest of us "at risk", these are probably the same prep/crier people that think this is all completely necessary, if anything we have learned how unprepared and pathetic some people are.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by xcr440 View Post
    My main concern with all this is the precedent we are setting. What happens the next time this or any other virus sweeps the globe?

    Not many are going to want to be in a service industry job, where you might be TOLD you can't work, no matter how much you want to. Just saying. Restaurants and the like are going to take a beating on this for MONTHS, LONG after "they" tell us its ok to go out again.
    X100,000,000!!!!!

  20. #20
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    "The old, the sick & the weak"? How about the young, the healthy & the strong? This is an equal opportunity destroyer. I can hear it already, wait for version 2.0! -Mezz

  21. #21
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    How's about we all take a step back and a deep breath. This stupid virus has many at a heightened sense of worry, whether it is about getting sick or falling into financial ruin. Both perfectly legit things to be worried about.

    If I can, I would like everyone posting here to avoid making generalities like "ALL the persons that think...". This tends to insult folks that do think that way, but who's actions are not in the thing being complained about. As an example, refrain from saying "All the persons taking this lightly and getting everyone else sick".

    I am all for debate and discussion. Always have been. There is a lot of crappy things going on right now, but also a lot of great things being done. The list is really way too long (which gives me an idea, stay tuned...) to put here, but I am still proud to be an American. This nation will most likely lead the way in ending this global situation.

    As for my own personal situation and state of mind...I fell pretty safe. I am so grateful to live where I do. Any more remote and I would have to move to the moon. If I do get sick, it will be from my own doing, by not washing/sanitizing my hands and/or putting my hands to my face. Got both down pretty good, but still a bit more work to do. I am not afraid to die, I have faced down death 8 times in my nearly 54 years on this planet. That means without direct and in some cases, immediate medical intervention, I would not be here. My biggest fear is to leave Nora and Grace in a situation where they would struggle. I am working everyday to put us in a situation where that would not be a concern. Not that I would want to die when that situation is solved, but would have some greater piece of mind.

    So carry on, talk this thing to death and then we will all be able to get back to the life we had just a few weeks ago!

    Stay well and ThinkSnow!... for next season.

    OH, and legend02, thanks for that link. It is excellent!

    -John

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by candyman View Post
    Take a look at all the businesses that are in the Northwoods Directory on this site! These businesses can’t survive being closed down much longer, and the lasting effects of this will be devastating for the ones who do make it thru. There’s a huge chance your favorite bar,lodge,motel or resort will be closed next winter. If you think closing down the whole country, state is good idea,then I suggest looking at this through my eyes as business owner. Is the cure worse than the virus? It all depends who you ask! A person that was sent home with full pay that works for the government would say no! A husband and wife that may lose everything in short few months would say yes.
    AGAIN X100,000,000!!! Oh but wait a minute....all of us business owners are all independently wealthy!! the cure is definitely worse than the virus and what of the next one that comes around?
    Yes...I am a small business owner....Yes...I am what would be considered high risk as far as virus goes and YES... my opinion will still be the same if it ends up putting me 6' under.

  23. #23
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    Just to keep some perspective:

    Number of deaths for leading causes of death:

    Heart disease: 647,457
    Cancer: 599,108
    Accidents (unintentional injuries): 169,936
    Chronic lower respiratory diseases: 160,201
    Stroke (cerebrovascular diseases): 146,383
    Alzheimer’s disease: 121,404
    Diabetes: 83,564
    Influenza and Pneumonia: 55,672
    Nephritis, nephrotic syndrome and nephrosis: 50,633
    Intentional self-harm (suicide): 47,173

    Annual snowmobile deaths may or may not be included under the accidents or suicide totals

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by latner View Post
    Just to keep some perspective:

    Number of deaths for leading causes of death Ö
    Per day, per fortnight, per month, per year, per decade, Ö ?
    Those are just meaningless numbers without that little tidbit of information!

  25. #25
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    per year

  26. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by latner View Post
    Just to keep some perspective:

    Number of deaths for leading causes of death:

    Heart disease: 647,457
    Cancer: 599,108
    Accidents (unintentional injuries): 169,936
    Chronic lower respiratory diseases: 160,201
    Stroke (cerebrovascular diseases): 146,383
    Alzheimerís disease: 121,404
    Diabetes: 83,564
    Influenza and Pneumonia: 55,672
    Nephritis, nephrotic syndrome and nephrosis: 50,633
    Intentional self-harm (suicide): 47,173

    Annual snowmobile deaths may or may not be included under the accidents or suicide totals
    Maybe in accidents. But not in suicides.

  27. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by mezz View Post
    "The old, the sick & the weak"? How about the young, the healthy & the strong? This is an equal opportunity destroyer. I can hear it already, wait for version 2.0! -Mezz
    Not equal at all. In Italy, which has had over 10,000 deaths now, the average age at death (from COVID-19) is 78 years old. That doesn't mean that younger folks can't die from it (especially if they have health issues), but the elderly are at a FAR higher risk of death from this virus.


    Researchers on Monday announced the most comprehensive estimates to date of elderly people’s elevated risk of serious illness and death from the new coronavirus: Covid-19 kills an estimated 13.4% of patients 80 and older, compared to 1.25% of those in their 50s and 0.3% of those in their 40s. https://www.statnews.com/2020/03/30/...y-for-elderly/
    Last edited by DamageInc; 04-01-2020 at 05:31 PM.

  28. #28
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    Well no one knows my friend is a rn in a big metropolitan area. She is getting less hours right now because they do not have much going on. Its a really bad flu I want to see the stats of the underlying condition people had who died. I do not want anyone to die but big media blows everything out of proportion.

  29. #29
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    Got Drama! It's like CNN around here. There is nobody making friends on these threads. Let's all relax a little.

  30. #30
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    The big difference I see between comparing accidents, other diseases, etc to coronavirus statistics is that all the others are historical, and we know what has happened in past years.

    Anyone who thinks we (US and the world) really know what is going to happen with coronavirus has blinders on. Does anyone for sure know which model is going to be accurate, no they don't. Does anyone know if any of the models being run so far are actually worst case, no they don't. Does anyone truly know that keeping 6 foot distance prevents the transmission, no they don't. Reduce rate of transmission, well yes, but eliminate it, no. We really don't truly know how bad this can get.

    It is the drastic growth pace of this that is overwhelming our medical system, and once that happens, how long will it take to recover? No one knows for sure. How about we all do our part, stay home, and let the intensity drop to a rate that our medical system can handle it.

  31. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by jr37 View Post
    Got Drama! It's like CNN around here. There is nobody making friends on these threads. Let's all relax a little.
    What if this was January 1st not April 1st? I wonder if you would have got the same responses if they had shut down the snowmobile season in the Up?

  32. #32
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    Jup go ahead and just step back. Mother nature doesn't care if you are a rocket scientist or a president or an axe murderer. Mother nature only cares that you reproduce. As far as mother nature is concerned there is no reason for anyone to live past about 30 years old. This site is full of old people. I can understand the angst. But you are all pretty much irrelevant. As am I. I am 61. My Golden years were from 20 to30. So we're most of yours. But we were all too dumb to realize it. Mother nature always wins. This is just a little wake up call. If she was really serious she would have stuck us with Ebola.

  33. #33
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    Interesting that a few weeks of less pollution clears the skies over China and now the US and the rest of the planet. Humans are so incredibly arrogant as to how much they control. They control nothing. Mother nature is boss.

  34. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigSix View Post
    Nobody will be working in an office environment until mid-June at the earliest. I donít mean to scare anyone, but eventually, 1 out of every 2000 people in the USA will die from this. I didn't think this was serious at first either. Now I do.

    Check out this link:
    https://covid19.healthdata.org/projections

    This is from Chris Murray at the University of Washington. The data for this model is updated every morning at 6:00 am. PST. On the home page of IHME there is a update tab explaining changes. This dude is the best metrics guy in the country. The White House and Dr Birx are using his projections.
    posterity

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by grub View Post
    Nobody knows how many people have had this virus and recovered without ever having a test to see if they had it. Also most of the fatalities had underlying issues before the virus kicked in. How many of them would have died anyway? Nobody knows. So there is no way to calculate a definite mortality rate. You need 3 numbers to figure that out and the only number you have is how many people have been tested. Yes this is bad. But for the most part it is killing the old, the sick and the weak. Who were all going to die first anyway.
    Yep.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by boilerrph View Post
    It always amazes me to read some of the statements that are made by some on this site. It seems that many do not put a very high value on human life. Some seem to think that it's acceptable for the numerous fatalities on the snowmobile trails and now some are comparing the loss of life due to the covid-19 virus to the seasonal influenza and rationalizing that this is not more severe than the seasonal influenza. I am here to tell you that this is much more serious. I am a clinical pharmacist at a large hospital and we are just beginning to see the influx of covid patients. Although the groups that Grub mentioned are the most at risk, I can tell you that there are a significant number of hospitalized patients that do not fall in the high risk group. Just out of curiosity Grub, how do you know that the old, sick and weak "WERE ALL GOING TO DIE FIRST ANYWAY"?

    John, I pray that you and your family stay safe and healthy through this challenging time and as a fellow Purdue guy I say BOILER UP!!!
    where was your concern before the news media caused your concern over this cold?...simply post up a thread from the past 10 years or so....many 'pandemics" since then.

  35. #35
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    Lets all take some time and compare the medias minute by minute coverage of this "crisis" and compare it to minute by minute coverage of other cold/flu epidemics of the past.
    I'll wait.

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    Quote Originally Posted by candyman View Post
    Take a look at all the businesses that are in the Northwoods Directory on this site! These businesses canít survive being closed down much longer, and the lasting effects of this will be devastating for the ones who do make it thru. Thereís a huge chance your favorite bar,lodge,motel or resort will be closed next winter. If you think closing down the whole country, state is good idea,then I suggest looking at this through my eyes as business owner. Is the cure worse than the virus? It all depends who you ask! A person that was sent home with full pay that works for the government would say no! A husband and wife that may lose everything in short few months would say yes.
    I agree A few businesses around here cut back hrs or close due trail closure for spring breakup but not for 2 months Please support these guys if and when they reopen.

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    Quote Originally Posted by snobuilder View Post
    Lets all take some time and compare the medias minute by minute coverage of this "crisis" and compare it to minute by minute coverage of other cold/flu epidemics of the past.
    I'll wait.
    and waiting and waiting and waiting.... no response...surprised??

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    Quote Originally Posted by grub View Post
    Interesting that a few weeks of less pollution clears the skies over China and now the US and the rest of the planet. Humans are so incredibly arrogant as to how much they control. They control nothing. Mother nature is boss.
    Well, I am sorry that you feel no self-worth. I'm not ready to go yet. I've got things I want to do first.

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    Quote Originally Posted by euphoric1 View Post
    and waiting and waiting and waiting.... no response...surprised??
    Cannot comment. Stopped watching around 6-7 years ago. Not sure why anyone still would be. I'll wait.

  40. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by candyman View Post
    Take a look at all the businesses that are in the Northwoods Directory on this site! These businesses can’t survive being closed down much longer, and the lasting effects of this will be devastating for the ones who do make it thru. There’s a huge chance your favorite bar,lodge,motel or resort will be closed next winter. If you think closing down the whole country, state is good idea,then I suggest looking at this through my eyes as business owner. Is the cure worse than the virus? It all depends who you ask! A person that was sent home with full pay that works for the government would say no! A husband and wife that may lose everything in short few months would say yes.
    Not true in my 15 years in Vilas meltdown and break up mid March to early May is hotel , bar grill, and motel shut down time good time for improvements. Northwoods Residents try to go somewhere warm come back in May very traditional downtime for the Northwoods. Boat sales and snowmobile Spring sales may suffer but that’s discretionary spending and always suffers in recessions. The Northwoods businesses are a lot more resilient than you think. Also as New Yorkers fled the island for FL many cabin owners left the Midwest cities for the Northwoods. Things up north aren’t as bad as you think just check out Eagle River this weekend.

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    Quote Originally Posted by whitedust View Post
    Not true in my 15 years in Vilas meltdown and break up mid March to early May is hotel , bar grill, and motel shut down time good time for improvements. Northwoods Residents try to go somewhere warm come back in May very traditional downtime for the Northwoods. Boat sales and snowmobile Spring sales may suffer but that’s discretionary spending and always suffers in recessions. The Northwoods businesses are a lot more resilient than you think. Also as New Yorkers fled the island for FL many cabin owners left the Midwest cities for the Northwoods. Things up north aren’t as bad as you think just check out Eagle River this weekend.
    Your telling someone that owns a business that things aren’t as bad as I say!!! We are down 40 percent already for this summers bookings. On average we receive 4-6 bookings a day, we have not received 1 booking for 2 1/2 weeks. We’ve had 13,000 dollars of business cancelled so far since this has started. Come on over, I’ll show you our books. We called our insurance agent 2 days ago and he has had 5 restaurants already cancelled there policy’s with him due to they won’t be opening when this is all done. These are real numbers not someone sitting on the side lines saying your wrong! Everyday they keep pushing this stay at home policy further out, if this goes into fishing opener, I’m sure you’ll tell me that it won’t effect resorts, restaurants and lodging! Right! I’ve spent 52 years in the Northwoods and have seen so many businesses not make during good times, now throw this into the mix. I’m sorry I disagree with You!

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    Quote Originally Posted by candyman View Post
    Your telling someone that owns a business that things aren’t as bad as I say!!! We are down 40 percent already for this summers bookings. On average we receive 4-6 bookings a day, we have not received 1 booking for 2 1/2 weeks. We’ve had 13,000 dollars of business cancelled so far since this has started. Come on over, I’ll show you our books. We called our insurance agent 2 days ago and he has had 5 restaurants already cancelled there policy’s with him due to they won’t be opening when this is all done. These are real numbers not someone sitting on the side lines saying your wrong! Everyday they keep pushing this stay at home policy further out, if this goes into fishing opener, I’m sure you’ll tell me that it won’t effect resorts, restaurants and lodging! Right! I’ve spent 52 years in the Northwoods and have seen so many businesses not make during good times, now throw this into the mix. I’m sorry I disagree with You!
    I didn’t post 1 word regarding your business ,in Bayfieid,I presume but I do disagree with your generalizations that all the Northwoods is in trouble durning March thru April. I have buds that work retail in Eagle River and that business is booming in a traditional down period. I expect recovery in the stock market and all businesses to be vertical this summer. Sure consumers are conservative presently but we will get thru this Covid 19 and business will recover. Traditionally this is a down period in Vilas not much to do but watch snow and ice melt and slog thru the mud. Been there done it for 15 years but summer does arrive and population will increase. Things will get better then very much better later. I’m a glass 1/2 full not 1/2 empty and always thinking about improving my life never defeated.

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    Quote Originally Posted by whitedust View Post
    I didn’t post 1 word regarding your business ,in Bayfieid,I presume but I do disagree with your generalizations that all the Northwoods is in trouble durning March thru April. I have buds that work retail in Eagle River and that business is booming in a traditional down period. I expect recovery in the stock market and all businesses to be vertical this summer. Sure consumers are conservative presently but we will get thru this Covid 19 and business will recover. Traditionally this is a down period in Vilas not much to do but watch snow and ice melt and slog thru the mud. Been there done it for 15 years but summer does arrive and population will increase. Things will get better then very much better later. I’m a glass 1/2 full not 1/2 empty and always thinking about improving my life never defeated.
    Your missing my point; the cancellations and the 40 percent of decline in bookings is not for March and April business, it’s for May thru October. These are months that businesses up here need to make it. One bad month could be the end. Just because your local Walmart or hardware store in Eagle River is booming right now says nothing about what summer business will be. What else is open? There’s this thing called consumer confidence, kinda of lacking as of now.

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    Quote Originally Posted by xcr440 View Post
    There are gloves all over the parking lot of my local grocery store. Some people are just unbelievable.
    I saw the same thing. crazy

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    Quote Originally Posted by frnash View Post
    Per day, per fortnight, per month, per year, per decade, Ö ?
    Those are just meaningless numbers without that little tidbit of information!
    and most are not contagious

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    If this thing continues into the summer, I sure hope there is financial help given to the small businesses/sole proprietors that suffer. This President has proven well that he is no infectious disease expert, but he know's a thing or two about business and the economy. So there is hope.

    -John

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    Quote Originally Posted by grub View Post
    Jup go ahead and just step back. Mother nature doesn't care if you are a rocket scientist or a president or an axe murderer. Mother nature only cares that you reproduce. As far as mother nature is concerned there is no reason for anyone to live past about 30 years old. This site is full of old people. I can understand the angst. But you are all pretty much irrelevant. As am I. I am 61. My Golden years were from 20 to30. So we're most of yours. But we were all too dumb to realize it. Mother nature always wins. This is just a little wake up call. If she was really serious she would have stuck us with Ebola.

    There is no mother nature.

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    Quote Originally Posted by candyman View Post
    Your missing my point; the cancellations and the 40 percent of decline in bookings is not for March and April business, it’s for May thru October. These are months that businesses up here need to make it. One bad month could be the end. Just because your local Walmart or hardware store in Eagle River is booming right now says nothing about what summer business will be. What else is open? There’s this thing called consumer confidence, kinda of lacking as of now.
    I think people are in a "wait and see mode". When May/June get here, I'll bet your phone will be ringing off the hook. Hang in there and don't stress out over it; it never does any good.

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    Quote Originally Posted by dfattack View Post
    There is no mother nature.
    Sure is, she appeared in those Chiffon Commercials in the 70's.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9q6QkUaXx_A

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    Quote Originally Posted by candyman View Post
    Your missing my point; the cancellations and the 40 percent of decline in bookings is not for March and April business, itís for May thru October. These are months that businesses up here need to make it. One bad month could be the end. Just because your local Walmart or hardware store in Eagle River is booming right now says nothing about what summer business will be. What else is open? Thereís this thing called consumer confidence, kinda of lacking as of now.
    You both have valid points and of course what you are experiencing is real and can't be denied. I can see his point (Whitedust's) to some extent for a very short period of time. You on the other hand are already seeing a longer term effect. I just hope and pray things turn around quickly and you see a flood of bookings in May or June when people feel better about getting their lives back to normal.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Administrator View Post
    Sure is, she appeared in those Chiffon Commercials in the 70's.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9q6QkUaXx_A

    Hahahaha good one!

    I remember that one too!

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    Quote Originally Posted by dfattack View Post
    You both have valid points and of course what you are experiencing is real and can't be denied. I can see his point (Whitedust's) to some extent for a very short period of time. You on the other hand are already seeing a longer term effect. I just hope and pray things turn around quickly and you see a flood of bookings in May or June when people feel better about getting their lives back to normal.
    I think there are PLENTY of examples of long term effects on peoples well being already, and hoping what John pointed out is true about the stimulus helping.

    The thing I have a hard time believing right now, is just because "they" say we can go back to our lives as they were before this, is will people really do that?

    I have a bad feeling things may look entirely different when us tourasses start making our annual ventures up north next winter.....

    P.S. I remember the Mother Nature commercials! Flashback to my childhood for sure!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Administrator View Post
    Sure is, she appeared in those Chiffon Commercials in the 70's.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9q6QkUaXx_A
    Chiffon is no more (I've not seen in stores for years, of course I'm not main shopper for my family).
    So may be mother nature, may be no more also?
    LOL

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    Quote Originally Posted by Administrator View Post
    Cannot comment. Stopped watching around 6-7 years ago. Not sure why anyone still would be. I'll wait.
    John, Im not looking for an argument or being negative toward your response so please don't take this that way, just voicing an opinion. "not sure why anyone still would be" my question is why not? ok... lets not compare covid-19 to the flu however fact of the matter is they are both viruses but lets forget that. and again death should never become an acceptable out, And I hope the numbers aren't as predicted or being hyped about, but the only number we have that is a definite is ones who have died as result of virus. The flu which is still a virus kills on average half a million people a year, on average here 30,000 to 60,000 people and this is with something we have a vaccine for. Why don't we cover the flu just as we are the covid-19, why don't we practice social distancing, shutter businesses, put people out of work. If this is really working lets say by doing this again next year we can reduce the number of fatalities by half... why don't we? We now have millions of people with out work and who knows how many of them will have a job to return to? can the unemployment pool continue to support millions upon millions and what of the businesses that will never reopen. So yes why don't we have the media coverage for flu season that kills so many people year after year after year, and if this is all working why don't we do the same if we can reduce fatalities, since we have no idea how many people have it how can we say its working?

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    Quote Originally Posted by candyman View Post
    Your missing my point; the cancellations and the 40 percent of decline in bookings is not for March and April business, it’s for May thru October. These are months that businesses up here need to make it. One bad month could be the end. Just because your local Walmart or hardware store in Eagle River is booming right now says nothing about what summer business will be. What else is open? There’s this thing called consumer confidence, kinda of lacking as of now.
    There are winners and losers in business that’s how it goes, nothing new if not prepared for the worst that can happen. In this case the entire world for the most part took a severe hit to their earnings me included. I was somewhat prepared for this but I never overspend don’t buy on credit. I’m still all ahead full on spending with cash on hand that I saved for retirement. I plan on many trips up north next winter just add snow and I’m there unless I’m dead. Lol Of course consumers are canceling trips currently as some are getting paid via vacation time. I hope you make it and I’m sure your business will improve in time hang in there. Actually fishing is an approved activity due to distance from others so the opener will happen to some degree. There is a future this is not the end imo.

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    Quote Originally Posted by euphoric1 View Post
    John, Im not looking for an argument or being negative toward your response so please don't take this that way, just voicing an opinion. "not sure why anyone still would be" my question is why not? ok... lets not compare covid-19 to the flu however fact of the matter is they are both viruses but lets forget that. and again death should never become an acceptable out, And I hope the numbers aren't as predicted or being hyped about, but the only number we have that is a definite is ones who have died as result of virus. The flu which is still a virus kills on average half a million people a year, on average here 30,000 to 60,000 people and this is with something we have a vaccine for. Why don't we cover the flu just as we are the covid-19, why don't we practice social distancing, shutter businesses, put people out of work. If this is really working lets say by doing this again next year we can reduce the number of fatalities by half... why don't we? We now have millions of people with out work and who knows how many of them will have a job to return to? can the unemployment pool continue to support millions upon millions and what of the businesses that will never reopen. So yes why don't we have the media coverage for flu season that kills so many people year after year after year, and if this is all working why don't we do the same if we can reduce fatalities, since we have no idea how many people have it how can we say its working?
    Well said, Sir!

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    Quote Originally Posted by euphoric1 View Post
    John, Im not looking for an argument or being negative toward your response so please don't take this that way, just voicing an opinion. "not sure why anyone still would be" my question is why not? ok... lets not compare covid-19 to the flu however fact of the matter is they are both viruses but lets forget that. and again death should never become an acceptable out, And I hope the numbers aren't as predicted or being hyped about, but the only number we have that is a definite is ones who have died as result of virus. The flu which is still a virus kills on average half a million people a year, on average here 30,000 to 60,000 people and this is with something we have a vaccine for. Why don't we cover the flu just as we are the covid-19, why don't we practice social distancing, shutter businesses, put people out of work. If this is really working lets say by doing this again next year we can reduce the number of fatalities by half... why don't we? We now have millions of people with out work and who knows how many of them will have a job to return to? can the unemployment pool continue to support millions upon millions and what of the businesses that will never reopen. So yes why don't we have the media coverage for flu season that kills so many people year after year after year, and if this is all working why don't we do the same if we can reduce fatalities, since we have no idea how many people have it how can we say its working?
    100% agree. Regardless of what we are being told. It will be YEARS before we recover from this economically. The lion has a thorn in its paw and we are willing to kill the lion to "save it".

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    Quote Originally Posted by whitedust View Post
    There are winners and losers in business that’s how it goes, nothing new if not prepared for the worst that can happen. In this case the entire world for the most part took a severe hit to their earnings me included. I was somewhat prepared for this but I never overspend don’t buy on credit. I’m still all ahead full on spending with cash on hand that I saved for retirement. I plan on many trips up north next winter just add snow and I’m there unless I’m dead. Lol Of course consumers are canceling trips currently as some are getting paid via vacation time. I hope you make it and I’m sure your business will improve in time hang in there. Actually fishing is an approved activity due to distance from others so the opener will happen to some degree. There is a future this is not the end imo.
    You are missing one VERY important point here. Those businesses are being TOLD to close, they are not doing it by choice, or by making poor business decisions.

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    Quote Originally Posted by tquick67675 View Post
    100% agree. Regardless of what we are being told. It will be YEARS before we recover from this economically. The lion has a thorn in its paw and we are willing to kill the lion to "save it".
    You are being hoodwinked sir....most of this is on purpose....these deaths from virus and disease have been occurring every year in fantastically huge numbers since 1918....the only change is the media (owned by dems) have never sensationalized it like they are now...that is reality....do some research if none of you believe me....250,000 in US alone every year for last 50 years every year...world wide...just the flu not including other diseases is 650,000.....keep all that in mind

    PS...wearing latex gloves around everywhere like some are only spreads the germs onto your steering wheel and everything you touch....bare hands are 100 times cleaner....just wash them...most people are not bright and don't think about what they are doing and how it effects stuff down the line of their actions....just sayin'

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    Quote Originally Posted by xcr440 View Post
    You are missing one VERY important point here. Those businesses are being TOLD to close, they are not doing it by choice, or by making poor business decisions.
    Yes and churches and gun stores. How many of our rights are getting trampled on in the name of safety? Right to assemble. Freedom of Religion. Keep and bear arms. This is a scary precedent to be setting. Imagine what future politicians could do now that this door is opened....

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    Default Virus word to the wise

    FYI....wearing latex gloves at the store and wherever you go only spreads the germs on to every single surface you touch once it's on your gloves....you door handles...steering wheel...shopping cart .....groceries and boxes you bring into your house....and then your actually creating infected recycling material and or throwing on the ground into environment....wearing gloves and masks do more harm than good...bare hands are 100 times cleaner...just wash...and the masks only protect other people from you....if....if you are sick....you must think of this logically and how they spread if your worried...

    1st responders and nurses only wear that crap because they are around KNOWN sick people...you dont have to do that

    Ps....when I have change coming back from a transaction I say....keep the tip....helps them out...you are not such a tight wad then...and keeps you safer.....carry on

    Feel free to add more tips...try to keep them logical....God ain't going to help you....since he could be a jar of peanut butter....noone knows so don't give me or anyone else none of that jazz please
    Last edited by Tracker; 04-02-2020 at 10:51 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by euphoric1 View Post
    John, Im not looking for an argument or being negative toward your response so please don't take this that way, just voicing an opinion. "not sure why anyone still would be" my question is why not? ok... lets not compare covid-19 to the flu however fact of the matter is they are both viruses but lets forget that. and again death should never become an acceptable out, And I hope the numbers aren't as predicted or being hyped about, but the only number we have that is a definite is ones who have died as result of virus. The flu which is still a virus kills on average half a million people a year, on average here 30,000 to 60,000 people and this is with something we have a vaccine for. Why don't we cover the flu just as we are the covid-19, why don't we practice social distancing, shutter businesses, put people out of work. If this is really working lets say by doing this again next year we can reduce the number of fatalities by half... why don't we? We now have millions of people with out work and who knows how many of them will have a job to return to? can the unemployment pool continue to support millions upon millions and what of the businesses that will never reopen. So yes why don't we have the media coverage for flu season that kills so many people year after year after year, and if this is all working why don't we do the same if we can reduce fatalities, since we have no idea how many people have it how can we say its working?
    I’m not sure my point was taken correctly, so I will do a better job to try to clarify. I stopped watching the main stream media 6 to 7 years ago, because after watching them totally batch or make up things regarding the atmosphere, I started to question their knowledge or they’re trustworthiness. I had conversations with other professionals such as my brother who is a commercial airline pilot and friends who are doctors and they all commented the same way, saying that most of what the news was presenting in those fields was also incorrect. So I decided to just stop watching because I was being misinformed, intentionally or unintentionally, It did not matter. It seems a lot of people these days have the same feeling about the media yet they continue to watch and complain so that’s why I ask why does anybody watch them anymore. I currently still am undecided as to if the measures put in place we’re over done or not. That means I’m not arguing with anybody on either side. What I do know about this virus vs. the seasonal flu (And this comes from many doctors saying the same thing, including an ER doctor I know in Chicago), is that if left unchecked, meaning no restrictions at all, this virus had the potential to kill 5-10% of the global population. The reason for this is they say 80% of the people that come down with it handle it just fine and need no hospital admission. The other 20% do need hospitalization and of that 20%, 25 to 50% need ventilators. Without the ventilators they would die. The whole purpose in slowing down the amount of cases with this virus is to allow healthcare to be able to treat people in the manner that is needed. They also said that if you need a ventilator it does not matter what age you are if you don’t get it you will die.I trust this information as it did not come from a political leader or the media and was repeated nearly Word for Word by every doctor I have researched that has been interviewed.

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    Media! Don't get me started!! (darn it, too late) I haven't watched the big three network news in probably 15 years. I couldn't tell you who their anchors are and I don't care. Here's what i do if it's something big like the current events. I'll watch 20 minutes of Fox and then 20 minutes of MSNBC and assume the truth is somewhere in the middle.

    Here's a quote from the great Civil War general, William Tecumseh Sherman

    "If I had my choice I would hang every reporter in the world, but I am sure we would be getting reports from h e l l before breakfast."

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    is it familiarity that breeds contempt and anxiety makes you scratch till you bleed. using yet another cliche "you are beating a dead horse"

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    You said some form of ' I ' 4 times in 24 words. That would qualify for some title somewhere. No matter. Mother Nature will scrub you off the face of the Earth. Just like a mosquito. Whether you have things to do is pretty much irrelevant. Your overdeveloped sense of self worth is rather amusing.

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    John Dees quit worrying. Even though saddled with pre existing conditions you are not an idiot and I would bet you have self isolated for 2 weeks already. Keep doing that. However you should at least be aware of the media. Shutting it off for 7 years keeps you out of that loop. You should at least be aware of what is going on with that side. In the mean time stay home. For at least month.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Administrator View Post
    I’m not sure my point was taken correctly, so I will do a better job to try to clarify. I stopped watching the main stream media 6 to 7 years ago, because after watching them totally batch or make up things regarding the atmosphere, I started to question their knowledge or they’re trustworthiness. I had conversations with other professionals such as my brother who is a commercial airline pilot and friends who are doctors and they all commented the same way, saying that most of what the news was presenting in those fields was also incorrect. So I decided to just stop watching because I was being misinformed, intentionally or unintentionally, It did not matter. It seems a lot of people these days have the same feeling about the media yet they continue to watch and complain so that’s why I ask why does anybody watch them anymore. I currently still am undecided as to if the measures put in place we’re over done or not. That means I’m not arguing with anybody on either side. What I do know about this virus vs. the seasonal flu (And this comes from many doctors saying the same thing, including an ER doctor I know in Chicago), is that if left unchecked, meaning no restrictions at all, this virus had the potential to kill 5-10% of the global population. The reason for this is they say 80% of the people that come down with it handle it just fine and need no hospital admission. The other 20% do need hospitalization and of that 20%, 25 to 50% need ventilators. Without the ventilators they would die. The whole purpose in slowing down the amount of cases with this virus is to allow healthcare to be able to treat people in the manner that is needed. They also said that if you need a ventilator it does not matter what age you are if you don’t get it you will die.I trust this information as it did not come from a political leader or the media and was repeated nearly Word for Word by every doctor I have researched that has been interviewed.
    I agree 100% with this too john...my brother is a pilot also and we all noticed the same thing as well...the lying and manipulating just shot off the charts and most people dont believe that they are doing this...its more than ever right now...its a last ditch effort that won't work for them

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    Grub I don't know what happened to you but man put the cap back on the stupid pills you found. Wow. Take a break man!!

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    i like to see a positive in alla this c-19 destruction. I see that I agree with many ppl on here that in the past I have had little squabbles with about mostly nothing.

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    Quote Originally Posted by snobuilder View Post
    i like to see a positive in alla this c-19 destruction. I see that I agree with many ppl on here that in the past I have had little squabbles with about mostly nothing.
    Maybe we should all go on a group ride next year!

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    In!!!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by slimcake View Post
    In!!!!
    Quote Originally Posted by dfattack View Post
    Maybe we should all go on a group ride next year!
    I'd go on a ride with y'all

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    Quote Originally Posted by scoot View Post
    Be advised, my malware protection went red alert nuclear when I clicked on the site posted above.
    Danger danger Will Robinson....
    Your so full of it you smell....dont want people to see it....or else get someone other than ED NORTON to stop trying to protect you OTIS....not one anti virus went off I tested....nice try little scoots....lmao

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by slimcake View Post
    Grub I don't know what happened to you but man put the cap back on the stupid pills you found. Wow. Take a break man!!
    He has swallowed.....lol

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    Quote Originally Posted by xcr440 View Post
    You are missing one VERY important point here. Those businesses are being TOLD to close, they are not doing it by choice, or by making poor business decisions.
    Yes some businesses have been told to close but if you dig deeper appointments can be made services and products are being bought and sold you just need to be creative not accept things as black and white. There’s a lot more going on than you may think. Where there is a will there is away and a whole lot of business ongoing in the gray currently. Check it out dig deeper if you want to purchase you will find many willing partners just have to ask. Things are fluid if you dig deeper. I’m very surprised so many are convinced closed means closed. A simple phone call can get you access by appointment home or sales facility. I’m accomplishing most of my purchasing goals more difficult and time consuming but very doable.

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    [QUOTE=Tracker;492713]Your so full of it you smell....dont want people to see it....or else get someone other than ED NORTON to stop trying to protect you OTIS....not one anti virus went off I tested....nice try little scoots....lmao
    [COLOR="silver"][SIZE=1]

    Nope my malware flagged it big time. Thought folks should be warned or check to make sure their malware is up to date. And if you believe your quote is true, you are "lmao" flipping hilarious. Must be awesome seeing boogie men everywhere you look. Watch out for them bigfoots in the black helicopters and drink the coolaid, DRINK IT!!!

  75. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by harvest1121 View Post
    Well no one knows my friend is a rn in a big metropolitan area. She is getting less hours right now because they do not have much going on. Its a really bad flu I want to see the stats of the underlying condition people had who died. I do not want anyone to die but big media blows everything out of proportion.
    Not much going on? This goes against everything I have been hearing. I have a good friend who is a traveling nurse. She is currently in Los Angeles. Lots of scary stories directly from her and shared from other health care workers of how scary this is. Hospitals running out of beds. Not enough staff to accommodate all the patients. Regular rooms turned into ICU rooms. Hospital cafeterias turned into makeshift hospital rooms. I could go on, but to say a RN is getting less hours because there isn't anything going on is just ridiculous.

    **UPDATE** After thinking this through I realized there are a lot of more non critical healthcare areas that are probably slowing way down, because they don't want people coming in for appointments that aren't critical. So if you work in that area you most likely are seeing a downturn now. I know many people have had routine Dr appointments cancelled until after the this is over. The areas that are seeing the overwhelming shortage of healthcare workers and beds is emergency, urgent, triage for more critical healthcare.
    Last edited by snowdance; 04-03-2020 at 08:46 AM.

  76. #76
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    Quote Originally Posted by grub View Post
    John Dees quit worrying. Even though saddled with pre existing conditions you are not an idiot and I would bet you have self isolated for 2 weeks already. Keep doing that. However you should at least be aware of the media. Shutting it off for 7 years keeps you out of that loop. You should at least be aware of what is going on with that side. In the mean time stay home. For at least month.
    Thanks Grub. I'm good and not worried. I have been isolated for at least 2 weeks and have no plans to leave the homestead (kind of a nice feeling actually!). I do watch the local news out of Marquette. They do an excellent job of reporting the news, not manufacturing or dramatizing it. Mostly local stories, but when an important national or global issue is going on, they cover it. I also have some good outlets for info. And, there is always Facebook for reliable info!

  77. #77
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    John, you live in a wonderful part of this country, and the chances are very low for your area. I however live 30 miles north of Chicago, and its a very real possibility here now, and don't even want to think about what it will be in two weeks.

  78. #78
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    Quote Originally Posted by whitedust View Post
    Yes some businesses have been told to close but if you dig deeper appointments can be made services and products are being bought and sold you just need to be creative not accept things as black and white. There’s a lot more going on than you may think. Where there is a will there is away and a whole lot of business ongoing in the gray currently. Check it out dig deeper if you want to purchase you will find many willing partners just have to ask. Things are fluid if you dig deeper. I’m very surprised so many are convinced closed means closed. A simple phone call can get you access by appointment home or sales facility. I’m accomplishing most of my purchasing goals more difficult and time consuming but very doable.
    I understand that. You can still get most anything you want, including sled parts and service if that's your desire. I thought the discussion with Candyman was around the resorts and bar/restaurants that have been told to "close" their dining services, and gatherings. Yes, many are doing take out, maybe some are even selling alcohol on take out, but there is no way that keeps up with their prior sales numbers, and right along with rentals when people are TOLD to stay home.

    I hope these places can make it, but if this drags on and on through the summer, MANY will not.

  79. #79
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    Quote Originally Posted by katden4 View Post
    John, you live in a wonderful part of this country, and the chances are very low for your area. I however live 30 miles north of Chicago, and its a very real possibility here now, and don't
    even want to think about what it will be in two weeks.
    Thanks, you are right. Even our spot of the Keweenaw is more remote that much of the Keweenaw. Many locals do not even know where Jacobsville is!

    I was perusing the statistics for other countries (I kind of like doing fiddling around with geography/cartography and demographics) and the data from Japan and S. Korea really sparked my interest. Their numbers are amazingly low. Did some research and saw interviews with a few Dr's that said persons in their countries were forced to wear masks (not even the N95) when in public and they believe strongly that this is a big reason. One Dr finished his interview saying that if you are watching this, PLEASE wear a mask. Even if your countries health officials are not yet telling you to. I have a feeling that our health officials will be coming around to this, hopefully in not too long. Sometimes the US can be a little to proud, or should I call it pig-headed!

    I wish you all the best. Keep us updated.

    -John

  80. #80
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    Quote Originally Posted by gary_in_neenah View Post
    Media! Don't get me started!! (darn it, too late) I haven't watched the big three network news in probably 15 years. I couldn't tell you who their anchors are and I don't care. Here's what i do if it's something big like the current events. I'll watch 20 minutes of Fox and then 20 minutes of MSNBC and assume the truth is somewhere in the middle.

    Here's a quote from the great Civil War general, William Tecumseh Sherman

    "If I had my choice I would hang every reporter in the world, but I am sure we would be getting reports from h e l l before breakfast."
    True on both counts.

  81. #81
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    Quote Originally Posted by xcr440 View Post
    I understand that. You can still get most anything you want, including sled parts and service if that's your desire. I thought the discussion with Candyman was around the resorts and bar/restaurants that have been told to "close" their dining services, and gatherings. Yes, many are doing take out, maybe some are even selling alcohol on take out, but there is no way that keeps up with their prior sales numbers, and right along with rentals when people are TOLD to stay home.

    I hope these places can make it, but if this drags on and on through the summer, MANY will not.
    Exactly, this current business model due to the virus is not sustainable. It's what businesses are doing to ensure their employees keep going home with paychecks and to make sure when this all over there's still a business to run. Some businesses have drive thru's and that's great. Maybe maintain 80-90% of their normal sales, but that's only temporary. That can only last a few months due to the PPP program. Without that even the businesses with Drive thrus won't last. What about other types of restaurants, hotels, etc. that don't have that option. Clock is ticking and this needs to come to an end very soon or there will be a lot of people out of business.

  82. #82
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    Quote Originally Posted by dfattack View Post
    Exactly, this current business model due to the virus is not sustainable. It's what businesses are doing to ensure their employees keep going home with paychecks and to make sure when this all over there's still a business to run. Some businesses have drive thru's and that's great. Maybe maintain 80-90% of their normal sales, but that's only temporary. That can only last a few months due to the PPP program. Without that even the businesses with Drive thrus won't last. What about other types of restaurants, hotels, etc. that don't have that option. Clock is ticking and this needs to come to an end very soon or there will be a lot of people out of business.
    Restaurants, not referring to fast food ones, are saying that even with operating a pick up business are only generating 20% of their normal sales, at 20% you can hardly afford to turn the lights on, and when these businesses cant reopen I assure you there isn't an abundance or people waiting to open a business, not to mention the people that will have lost their job as result of, these small businesses will have a more immediate effect on the local economy with the loss of tax generation, loss of jobs and will there be an abundance of jobs available for the people that are no longer working? I am curious to see what will happen to the unemployment insurance rate as this continues, as im sure the pool will implode on itself as the jobless rate continues to expand faster than the virus itself. And this is where I am completely miffed, disgusted that we are forgiving $10,000.00 of student loans, who are not a direct effect on the economy yet we are forcing businesses to seek loans or close their doors and they are an immediate/direct affect on the economy, it just makes no sense. dfattack I agree "this needs to come to an end...and VERY SOON!!"

  83. #83
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    Anyone in the Twin Cities happen to catch the story on CH 5 last evening that reported 6 deaths LAST WEEK from the FLU?? Guess the lock down hasn't stopped that, seeing as that was TWO WEEKS after they first told us to "Social Distance".

    And is it coincidence that story was on the 6:00, but not the 10:00?

    Edit: This was for MN only.
    Last edited by xcr440; 04-03-2020 at 11:04 AM.

  84. #84
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    Quote Originally Posted by euphoric1 View Post
    Restaurants, not referring to fast food ones, are saying that even with operating a pick up business are only generating 20% of their normal sales, at 20% you can hardly afford to turn the lights on, and when these businesses cant reopen I assure you there isn't an abundance or people waiting to open a business, not to mention the people that will have lost their job as result of, these small businesses will have a more immediate effect on the local economy with the loss of tax generation, loss of jobs and will there be an abundance of jobs available for the people that are no longer working? I am curious to see what will happen to the unemployment insurance rate as this continues, as im sure the pool will implode on itself as the jobless rate continues to expand faster than the virus itself. And this is where I am completely miffed, disgusted that we are forgiving $10,000.00 of student loans, who are not a direct effect on the economy yet we are forcing businesses to seek loans or close their doors and they are an immediate/direct affect on the economy, it just makes no sense. dfattack I agree "this needs to come to an end...and VERY SOON!!"
    From what I have seen (wall street journal https://www.wsj.com/articles/stimulu...rs-11585486801)
    The push to forgive a portion of student loan debt was unsuccessful. Screenshot_20200403-094623_Chrome.jpg
    There had already been in place forgiveness packages. The stimulas package did include, suspension of payments due during this crisis, that will count as on time payments. Towards their on time payments, needed to satisfy the programs 120 on time payments for forgiveness of part of their debt. Public service loan forgiveness, for instance. These programs were in place prior to this crisis. There are very strict rules for enrollment and guidelines for the loan portions to be erased.

  85. #85
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    Quote Originally Posted by xcr440 View Post
    I understand that. You can still get most anything you want, including sled parts and service if that's your desire. I thought the discussion with Candyman was around the resorts and bar/restaurants that have been told to "close" their dining services, and gatherings. Yes, many are doing take out, maybe some are even selling alcohol on take out, but there is no way that keeps up with their prior sales numbers, and right along with rentals when people are TOLD to stay home.

    I hope these places can make it, but if this drags on and on through the summer, MANY will not.
    None of this is sustainable totally agree but I did want to let consumers know sales and services are still available if you ask. Closed doesnít mean closed call ahead see whatís doable.

  86. #86
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    Quote Originally Posted by sweeperguy View Post
    From what I have seen (wall street journal https://www.wsj.com/articles/stimulu...rs-11585486801)
    The push to forgive a portion of student loan debt was unsuccessful. Screenshot_20200403-094623_Chrome.jpg
    There had already been in place forgiveness packages. The stimulas package did include, suspension of payments due during this crisis, that will count as on time payments. Towards their on time payments, needed to satisfy the programs 120 on time payments for forgiveness of part of their debt. Public service loan forgiveness, for instance. These programs were in place prior to this crisis. There are very strict rules for enrollment and guidelines for the loan portions to be erased.
    I stand corrected, and that is very good news, if they were prepared to do so and now they are not they should take that funding to help small businesses that were forced to shutter and help an already struggling dairy industry that has been handed a short hand once again. Im glad the forgiveness plan didn't pass, now lets help something with a more direct effect on the economy.

  87. #87
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    Here's an interesting one (fun to watch the animation, at least).
    (click →) How to tell if we are beating COVID-19 (YootToob video, 7 min. +15 sec.)

  88. #88
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    Quote Originally Posted by gary_in_neenah View Post
    Media! Don't get me started!! (darn it, too late) I haven't watched the big three network news in probably 15 years. I couldn't tell you who their anchors are and I don't care. Here's what i do if it's something big like the current events. I'll watch 20 minutes of Fox and then 20 minutes of MSNBC and assume the truth is somewhere in the middle.

    Here's a quote from the great Civil War general, William Tecumseh Sherman

    "If I had my choice I would hang every reporter in the world, but I am sure we would be getting reports from h e l l before breakfast."
    Last I checked, Freedom of the Press was the first amendment to the Constitution.

    Thatís one before the 2nd Amendment, if youíre counting.

    Then thereís always Faux News, if you canít handle truth.

  89. #89
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    Quote Originally Posted by finn View Post
    Last I checked, Freedom of the Press was the first amendment to the Constitution.

    That’s one before the 2nd Amendment, if you’re counting.

    Then there’s always Faux News, if you can’t handle truth.
    Still in college aren't ya Finn?? Or highschool?? It's almost the end of my day and your comment is the..... Winner.... Nevermind

  90. #90

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    Quote Originally Posted by snowdance View Post
    Not much going on? This goes against everything I have been hearing. I have a good friend who is a traveling nurse. She is currently in Los Angeles. Lots of scary stories directly from her and shared from other health care workers of how scary this is. Hospitals running out of beds. Not enough staff to accommodate all the patients. Regular rooms turned into ICU rooms. Hospital cafeterias turned into makeshift hospital rooms. I could go on, but to say a RN is getting less hours because there isn't anything going on is just ridiculous.

    **UPDATE** After thinking this through I realized there are a lot of more non critical healthcare areas that are probably slowing way down, because they don't want people coming in for appointments that aren't critical. So if you work in that area you most likely are seeing a downturn now. I know many people have had routine Dr appointments cancelled until after the this is over. The areas that are seeing the overwhelming shortage of healthcare workers and beds is emergency, urgent, triage for more critical healthcare.
    Hospitals in Wisconsin are quite....pardon the pun....dead. There is nothing going on in them. Our business serves the majority of hospitals in Wisconsin from our 3 plants, and we're all down 30-40%. I actually closed our plant for the day today, because it just didn't pay to operate. Our business is directly tied to the number of people in hospitals, and I can tell you for a fact, hospital census in Wisconsin and Chicago is extremely low.

    In early March, none of our plants could keep up with demand. Now, we're sending most of our employees home after 5 hours each day.

    So...yes...in Wisconsin and Chicago....lots of Docs and RN's with nothing to do.

  91. #91
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    Quote Originally Posted by scoot View Post
    Be advised, my malware protection went red alert nuclear when I clicked on the site posted above.
    Danger danger Will Robinson....
    Your an idiot scoot...what's this say..lol

    Screenshot_20200403-221309_Chrome.jpg

  92. #92
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tracker View Post
    Your an idiot scoot...what's this say..lol

    Screenshot_20200403-221309_Chrome.jpg
    Did you have your mommy help you with this?

  93. #93
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    Heard on news, true or not, would assume to be true.... almost half of the states do not have the funds to support the unemployment need.... NOW WHAT?

  94. #94
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    Quote Originally Posted by finn View Post
    Last I checked, Freedom of the Press was the first amendment to the Constitution.

    That’s one before the 2nd Amendment, if you’re counting.

    Then there’s always Faux News, if you can’t handle truth.
    Freedom of the Press does not include the right to tell lies.

  95. #95
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    Quote Originally Posted by dothedoo View Post
    Hospitals in Wisconsin are quite....pardon the pun....dead. There is nothing going on in them. Our business serves the majority of hospitals in Wisconsin from our 3 plants, and we're all down 30-40%. I actually closed our plant for the day today, because it just didn't pay to operate. Our business is directly tied to the number of people in hospitals, and I can tell you for a fact, hospital census in Wisconsin and Chicago is extremely low.

    In early March, none of our plants could keep up with demand. Now, we're sending most of our employees home after 5 hours each day.

    So...yes...in Wisconsin and Chicago....lots of Docs and RN's with nothing to do.
    There have been videos from people showing the same in many places. Funny how this works - stay home, and think the virus is going to go away? Hmmm

  96. #96
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    I've also seen videos of people sneaking into hospitals to lick toilet seats and elevator buttons too...
    Its not a surprise that the hospital parking lots are nearly empty. And if you do wander inside, of course you wont see any virus victims, they'd be in isolation. In preparation hospitals have spent the last several weeks clearing beds, canceling selective procedures, etc. That equals less cars. Stands to reason non essential employees would stay home too. Hospitals are on lock down not allowing visitors, especially for a virus victims. That equals less cars. Even the hypochondriacs that wander into the ER when they have a tummy ache are staying home for obvious reasons. In preparation, my local Hooterville hospital has a refer trailer parked in their loading dock. Maybe its for beer... I get it, trying to explain away scary stuff is easier then excepting it. But to put it in terms some will understand, maybe everyone should be spending some time checking that their family health plans are paid up instead. The hospital bill to recover from a bad case of this will put a huge damper on next years snowmobiling.

  97. #97
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    Quote Originally Posted by scoot View Post
    Ö In preparation, my local Hooterville hospital has a refer [sic] trailer parked in their loading dock. Maybe its for beerÖ
    Maybe they're using those trailers as triage stations, from which they will refer patients to the main hospital when appropriate?

  98. #98
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    Maybe MKE is surrounded be several very new, very large, very empty hospitals.

    Maybe listening to the CNNMSNBCNEWYORKTIMES has you thinking every hospital in the US is in dire straights...

  99. #99
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tracker View Post
    Your an idiot scoot...what's this say..lol

    Screenshot_20200403-221309_Chrome.jpg
    Now now now there tracker, let’s not get in a big match here to see who’s virtual poop slinging catapult is bigger than the others....LOL

  100. #100
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    Well at least I know after an absolutely depressing week of watching the the milk, corn, and soybean markets dropping and getting in a fight with my husband ( pick you can buy 40 acres of land or a combine, but not both!) I can come on hear and read the newest responses and actually smile.

    Found out today a large 2,500 cow dairy that contracts to the twin cities school district is dumping all their milk. They will get paid through the end of May and then they will be in a world of hurt. Three small creameries in the state have told farmers to cut back production 10-25% that ship to them.

    When all the ethanol plants are shut down I don't want to know what happens to the corn price. I know someone a few years younger than me that penciled out buying his father's farm. He used 3.15 cent corn for his lowest price. I suggested he drop that number to 2.50. He said I was nuts that there was no way it would ever get that low again. That was 3 months ago. He bought the farm the end of January. We hit 2.83 here on Friday and he called me up and wanted to borrow my crystal ball. He said how did you know. I said welcome to farming. When you think it can't get worse just wait it can.

    It won't be just bars, restaurants, and tourist companies that take the hit. If this goes on for much longer an allready hurting agricultural community will start to collapse. I know 15 dairy farms personally that needed two years of $17 base milk to get on their feet. Not 6 months and then into the $12 range. I guess we will see what happens.

    Have a good morning!

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